Undercover Lawyer Forum » Introduction

Is this discrimination?

(89 posts)
  • Started 1 month ago by mountainbiker
  • Latest reply from littlelulu
  1. mountainbiker

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    MS
    I have already filled u the questionaire when i first mailed in my complaint.In that I included all the phone numbers and names parties involved. Since they are located in another city than where I live, it will be a phone interview.Anyway I gonna make some bullet points on my issues and share it with them.I will follow why,what, when and how process.

    LL
    Yes I am working on figuring out a high number. My case is complicated in that it involves racial discrimination and sex discrimination.Caucasian male boss favoring all female Caucasian female co-workers who are less qualified in everything like education, experience, knowledge, etc. And I am non-Caucasian male. So let me post here after I figure out that number and my interview details.

    Thanks
    MB

    Posted 2 weeks ago #
  2. msliberated

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    MB, that is why it's important that you highlights this issues because seldom that EEOC will touch on a combination of complaints. They basically choose religious descrimination to address IN MY case because its weighty and I guess the rest will just be the sorrunding issues. I have spoken to my investigator and he assured me that I am protected from retaliation for as long as the complaints are filed and under investigations. Yours might be a bit different because you no longer employed by them.
    SO, GO GET THEM MB!!! And win BIG $$$$$$! Justice for all of us(smile)

    Posted 2 weeks ago #
  3. mountainbiker

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    MS
    Actually I am still employed by them.I think that is why case is kinda weird because everyday I see the same guy that I preparing my case against now.They haven't threatened with layoff or firing since they know they will get into serious trouble than they already are.

    First my field my complaint with EEOC and then the boss came to know about it.Then he retaliated against me.So I filed a retaliation update to the EEOC. Now HR says they are serious. Not sure how they thought that for the past 6 months whatever I did - the documents, the calls to the ethics hotline, etc. - were just jokes or something.

    -MB

    Posted 2 weeks ago #
  4. msliberated

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    Got you MB! You got them by the balls then....so as OYS said squeeze it too!(LOL)(LOL)

    Posted 2 weeks ago #
  5. littlelulu

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    I ageee with MsLiberated, sounds like they have finally figured out that YOU are SERIOUS about this. ANYTHING they try to do to you will look like PURE DISCRIMINATION and RETALIATION for the actions you have taken. I think its great that they are openly trying to resolve this. MAYBE they realize that continuing to fight against you will just cost them more money and make your case highly visible against them.

    Posted 2 weeks ago #
  6. mountainbiker

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    MS
    Sure. Thats I think they are worried now.Up until now they played games with me making me look fool at every turn.Now the table is being turned and they don't like it a bit.
    I am trying to make sure that my rights are protected this time and I compensated for all the crap that I am going thru. Since I have a family I wasted so much of my time spending on this than with my kids.

    LL
    Yes.They realized that I will not go away that easily and that I will fight all the way to court if needed. There have been many obvious violations right from the start but the HR knew about them and acted like nothing is wrong. Like for example my boss giving my salary review in a public area where everyone could listen and now some people know my compensation. Not mention the shame he put me thru since I was not given a raise and he tried to explain the reasons for over an hour.

    Also the place I work does not like publicity and they like flying under the radar though they are a public company. The funny thing about the whole story is that so many people including executives and many managers and other friends inside the company and outside think that I am a highly talented and smart individual for the company and industry that I work for. But my boss says that I can't even flip a burger at a fast food place properly. It is like almost 100+ are wrong and one guy is right in their judgement about me.How weird is that !.

    Thx
    -MB

    Posted 2 weeks ago #
  7. littlelulu

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    Sounds like they are on a MAJOR POWER TRIP. I hope by the time you are done, you will be compensated for all you have suffered AND are able to get some publicity about how poorly this company treats its slaves - I mean employees (wink & smile).

    Posted 2 weeks ago #
  8. msliberated

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    Just for saying that degrading comment asked in that settlement that your boss may never ever say hurtful things like that or you are to open the case again as retaliation. Also never agree on the idea that you may not be able to file again, because the settlement will only solve one of the three reasons of your complaint. Not all three....because if they will try to be released from all, then you will settle 3x as big $$$$$(I could be wrong on this) The Mediator/Investigator will try to solve it right away because, as UCL brought out it's good for his position.....better evaluation towards promotion?! So keep that in mind too! And do not go alone,.....you can ask if it's okay to bring someone with you for moral support. Two heads are better than one.......best to you on that day from all of us MB(smile)

    Posted 2 weeks ago #
  9. littlelulu

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    MsLiberated is right when she says don't go alone. Take a witness that you can trust. And barring that, take a tape recorder, plunk it down on the table and if they have a problem with the tape recorder, ask them what they have to hide.

    Posted 2 weeks ago #
  10. mountainbiker

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    LL
    Yes they are on a powertrip.Yes I am hoping and praying that I get compensated for all the suffering that I am going thru because of them.

    MS
    Sorry.I think I may confused you by the way I worded my statement "I can't even flip a burger at a fast food place properly". My boss actually did not say that statement.I was just meaning that in all the actions he has done like with my performance reviews, feedback on work etc he said that I am good but not great for my current position.Sometimes he says that I not a good fit for my job.

    Cool.I will not settle that easily. On Wednesday after my telephone interview with EEOC I will know what the next step is. Hopefully they will arrange a mediation with the employer and I will go from there. Yes.For that mediation meeting I will take someone with me since I don't trust the current employer with anything they do.

    Thanks
    -MB

    Posted 2 weeks ago #
  11. sleeplessCOP

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    Hi s'Cop.... I am mountainbiker. I am going thru a discrimination/retaliation situation with my employer.Seems like I may have to go for a settlement with them. OnYourSide and Littlelulu said that you wrote an article about how to calculate a settlement amount. Can you please tell me where to find that article in the site?. Thanks in advance. -MB

    Welcome MB .... I didn't actually write the article - more like edited several sources into one piece -///// they are in the new Academy Forum saved as reference under Course Materials ....think you can still join for $1 /// otherwise, let me know and will attempt to transfer back over .... hang in there ... s'Cop

    Posted 2 weeks ago #
  12. Python

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    I thought you could not take a taperecoder to mediation and that even the Mediators notes needed to be destroyed and the only person you could bring was your Lawyer.

    Posted 2 weeks ago #
  13. mountainbiker

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    Thanks SleeplessCop.I just replied to you via email. Can you please post that article here for me?.

    -MB

    Posted 2 weeks ago #
  14. sleeplessCOP

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    python - believe you are quite right about taping and document - all of which would have o be destroyed except any settlement documents ... all that is discussed during mediation is confidential to those in the room -

    you may however bring a non-lawyer 'advocate' with you but they must also sign the federal confidentiality agreement ....

    just some non-lawyer 2 cents -

    Posted 2 weeks ago #
  15. sleeplessCOP

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    MB - I will transfer it over under a new thread of 'Valuing your Case'

    Posted 2 weeks ago #
  16. mountainbiker

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    Thanks sleeplessCOP.

    Here is the update on my case.Yesterday I had a half hour telephone interview by the EEOC.

    The lady basically went thru some of the main items in my charge and got more details from me.I had mentioned the protected classes as race and sex. She said it could be national origin too since I am from another country. SO she marked that national origin category also. She asked why I thought it was racial and sex discrimination when I did not get a raise and a bonus. I explained to her that all the others in my team are Caucasian females and my boss likes them. I told her that he treats me differently than them.

    Then she asked if all of the department/company workers got raise this year.I said as far I know everyone did. In my team at least I know everyone got the company wide raise of at least 3%. She asked about the bonus. Asked what was the condition to get the bonus - like sales goals,profits, etc. I told her that rules for bonus is very generic and broad based. Nothing is clearly defined in the company policy. Every 6 months the manager gets to "nominate" someone for this bonus and they get it. Then she said it is highly subjective then. I said yes and he prefers my female co-workers for this. It is a huge amount since it is 15% one's annual pay.I said so far 3 times he did not nominate me and every time he gave it to his favored workers. She then asked for the month and names of those women who got it.

    As a side note on this:
    When they introduced this bonus program everyone in my company thought it will be abused since there was no rules to prevent favoritism. Exactly thats what is happening and managers are using it as a carrot to keep their pets happy. Whenever I asked who got it, he told "I can't say that.That is confidential..". So my boss thought he could play this game and screw me each time. He even sent me an email saying that it was "strictly on merit" but never said what merit meant.Officially HR says that they can't reveal who gets it each time since it is related to salary and that information is confidential.I think this is just BS. So its like my boss feels that he has the perfect cover to continue discriminating against me and get away with it.Almost like a perfect crime.

    She was kinda interested on more details when I told her that I worked there as a contractor for nearly 1.5 hours and no problems on performance was mentioned.In fact I was hired as a full-time employee since I was so good.Then once became FTE everything started going bad according to my boss. She asked if I worked for the same boss and which company I worked for at that time.

    Then she asked about the retaliation letter I sent and I gave her the details. She was surprised that I had no work allocated for next year when other have.Told me that if this retaliation continues that I should her directly and they will take care of things.

    Finally she said she will type up the formal charge and mail it to me in the next few days for me sign and send it back.Once that happens, they will send the charge to the company and ask if they want to participate in mediation.She said I have to be very patient since this process may take 6+ months from now.But said she highly recommends it since it is very effective.

    There some things we did not get to discuss since she asked me specific questions. Some of them are me not getting a promotion (related to my performance issue which is in the formal charge),my English communication skills, etc. They were mentioned in the documents I submitted to them. But I guess thats ok since all these can be brought up in the mediation right?

    Let us see how it goes from here.

    Posted 2 weeks ago #
  17. sleeplessCOP

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    Well MB, not really .... mediation does not care and is not about presenting and arguing your case evidence.

    The mediator may give each side a few minutes to present their position - but it will not be like winning your case in a court hearing - the mediator is ONLY interested in what it will take for you to get what you want ..... so they can draw up a settlement statement and close/dismiss your case. The employer may not be willing to give you much if anything - basically daring you to hire a lawyer and sue them in court -

    From my own and experiences of others on the Forum - the employer across the table from you will deny everything and state that you do not have a valid claim or case against them -

    You will will then split up into separate rooms and the mediator will start by asking you what can the employer agree to give you so that you would settle and dismiss your case -

    Then the mediator will take that proposal to them in the other room - then keep shuttling back and forth with your demands and their counter-offers ....

    hang in there and keep us posted .... s'Cop

    Posted 2 weeks ago #
  18. msliberated

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    MB-I will also add that the Mediator's goal is to settle the case for his merits. It has nothing to do with you getting the justice you deserve. Even if you will have all the evidence, the mediator will not allow you nor will require you to present it. In fact in durng my Mediation the lawyer which my employer sent to represent the company was allowed present rebuttal against the biggest issue of my complaint. I honestly went there for experience. Not to discourage you, but it was very disappointing and a mockery. I went alone snd did not settle at all. My take on it is to be able to drag it also for as long as they(EEOC)can, watch and see the GIANT squirm(if possible) and so far things are FAIRLY working my way(smile)
    But your case may/or will be different. I was going for my rights, not only for me, for others as well.....and I am still employed.

    Posted 2 weeks ago #
  19. mountainbiker

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    SleeplessCop
    Thanks for explaining the mediation process.Sure.Now I understand that there will not any fact-finding missions or arguments of my case.Seems like mediation is just to close the case at the easiest way possible.

    I think my employer may do like you say - basically deny everything. Thats what they have been doing since day 1. However I work in an industry where reputation is very very important for the company.So they hate when people threaten to take them to court.However I am prepared to sue if needed.Already talked to a lawyer but I will see how mediation goes first.

    I printed a copy of the "How to value your case" article. It is very useful.Now I am working on calculating a settlement figure.One for still working there but in a different department and the other if they want to go for separation.

    MS
    I plan to take my spouse with me to the mediation.I will present them a number and see what they say. My case has merits since three times my boss threatened my job in less than 2 years, told that English communication needs to improved when nobody had told me that before (I went to grad school here and originally from another country), lied so many times I stopped counting, etc. So HR knows this but they just thought somehow I will go away.

    I will give them a hard time until they agree to my demands since I went thru so much crap.

    I will post an update when I receive the formal charge from EEOC. Thanks a lot for your advice.

    -MB

    Posted 1 week ago #
  20. mountainbiker

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    Hi
    I received my formal charge in the mail today. It asks me to review, make any corrections and return it.

    There are not much details mentioned in the actual charge.Hardly 10 lines are there despite having lots of free space. Last week during my interview with the EEOC investigator I gave her many details.

    Some of the details missing in this document are: deprived of promotions, the performance score was calculated wrong (it does say that the score was given meets expectations), etc. Three times my boss gave the bonus to 3 different Caucasian female co-workers.The EEOC investigator asked me all the 3 names and stuff. But this document
    says that two times they were given to them. It almost seems like they just type a condensed version of the story. Some of these we did not get to talk in that half hour interview but I mentioned them in my original filing with EEOC.

    Should I be concerned that many items have been left out? Since it is asking that I make corrections, should I attach a separate document and send it in with this formal charge?

    Another update with my case:
    Today my boss scheduled an hour meeting with to go over the questions I had sent about the work allocated. One of my question was why I was not selected to do the training of my customers.He said "I selected XXX (female Caucasian co-worker) to do the training.I did not select you because its a "high risk proposition". I do not understand what this means. Tomorrow I am gonna send him our meeting minutes and ask about this.

    Thanks in advance
    -MB

    Posted 1 week ago #
  21. littlelulu

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    DANGED, MB - this sounds too much like the complaint I filed with the Washington State Human Rights Commission (and that complaint initiated a complaint with the EEOC). That investigator at HRC did not address a 10th of my initial complaint so it came as no surprise that they blew off my complaint which of course also blew off the EEOC complaint. Thats when I decided to retain an attorney and forego the EEOC. I am not trying to be a downer for your case but if it was me, I would DEFINTELY add the things they left off your complaint to the formal charge. Maybe someone who has gone further with the EEOC can add what they did or would have done since I am not experienced in this process??

    Posted 1 week ago #
  22. msliberated

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    MB-Keep a copy of the notes you made at the initial interview. I had the same experience with mine. EEOC, seems to avoid/(do not) working on a combination of issues which really to us victims are very important. They will somehow peek more into any federally mandated violation of rights. Don't lose sleep over it. You have filed and your next step is the actual Mediation and after that you could request for thorough investigation or grab your right-to-sue notice and RUN......
    Be a good professional BOY in front your evil Boss. He has sensed the DANGER---he is looking out for himself, and himself only. Tha bulley is thretened and he could not stand it!!! This is when he starts screwing up and gets into deeper trouble.....he,he,he
    MB-YOU DID IT! You can now relax a little bit and stand by.
    Just my opinion based on my own experience........

    Posted 1 week ago #
  23. mountainbiker

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    LL
    Thanks for the reply.I am going to add a document including all the points left out to the EEOC formal charge and sent it back.This way everything will be recorded into the evidence for future and also the employer will get to receive all of them.I do not want to loose my case simply because I forgot to add all the things in the formal charge.

    MS
    Sure.I will do that.I took notes as I was being interviewed.In some ways it is understandable since they are flooded with so many cases now. In other ways I am just cautious to not loose my case. They did however get som every important points in the format charge since as "In July XXXX called the company 1800 ethics hotline and told that XXX felt uncomofrtable working for XXX". This is good since it clearly shows that the company failed to take any actions despite calling the so-called hotline.
    To be on the safe I will send them a list of things that were in my original complaint.Other than that I am not gonna worry about it.

    Yes I am working my job as usual and being friendly and professional with my boss. But I can see the anger in his actions towards me since he did not expect that I will so strong and fight for my interests.

    Thanks for your kind words.I feel a bit better. When going thru this type of ordeal it is very difficult to give my mind some peace it deserves.Today I am taking it slow since I received my conferment for completing an industry certification. So many people congratulated me. But my boss told in my performance review that this degree does not help the company. They paid the tuition for me.Isn't this sad.

    I will post any updates soon.
    -MB

    Posted 1 week ago #
  24. littlelulu

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    I think that most of these bully, retaliatory bosses *believe* that all their lowly employees would NEVER try to defend themselves because they feel they are ABOVE their employees. And sadly, too many employees ARE afraid to do anything and they just keep taking the abuse.......I firmly believe that is one of the main reasons people finally snap and "go postal"..........

    Posted 1 week ago #
  25. msliberated

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    Never will I do such a thing! They are NOT WORTH IT AT ALL! To me they are nothing but REFUSE, kind of people in this world. I will never, ever, ever let them win over me that way..........
    WE WILL SURVIVE!!!!!!!!!

    Posted 1 week ago #
  26. littlelulu

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    I agree with you 100%. I have a strong sense of what is right and what is wrong. I don't waste the time or energy on trivial things (like my ex-sup who ALWAYS has to be right does)because I HAVE A LIFE. I save my time and energy for total injustices like what I am going through as well as what EVERYONE is going through as far as bullying, discrimination and retaliation. THIS HAS TO STOP and we MUST work to have legislation passed to MAKE IT STOP. If we don't, we will continue to see even more people taking matters into their own hands which usually only ends up hurting MORE INNOCENT PEOPLE.

    Posted 1 week ago #
  27. mountainbiker

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    LL, ML
    An update on my case.
    I mailed in my formal charge this week to EEOC. Since they had left out many items, to be sure I included a letter saying that these are some additional points that I want to include in the formal charge. Basically listed all the main items in bullet items. I also signed for mediation.

    Meanwhile my boss has been making my work difficult everyday. He is forcing all the female co-workers give me a hard time in doing my work.For eg. - he said one of them is the responsible for adding things in the project. When I send that coworker my items to add, she asks he to send it to another person. Similarly another coworker used to very friendly with me before.Now the lady has turned against me and is making me do things her way as opposed to my own way. All these are in equal position as me and I suspect my boss is forcing them deliberately to give me hard time.

    When I complained to him and asked to send an email clearly detailing who will do what in the project, he says that it is not needed. You are professionals you can take of these among yourselves.He plays this game with me and then acts like he is God and I am kid.I am also kinda afraid that he is setting me up this way to do some other evil thing.

    I have already filed a retaliation complaint with EEOC and the lady in the interview asked me about that.Now instead of direct retaliation the guy is forcing my peers to make my life miserable.

    Can you give me some advice on how to deal with this situation? I am already documenting as much as I can via emails. It is so obvious that in the past week or so things have gotten so worse in doing my job. Weird things seem to happen for no reason like the coworkers are telling me how to do my job, etc.

    Thanks in advance.
    MB

    Posted 18 hours ago #
  28. msliberated

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    MB, that's okay, right now he's doing all he can to trap you into messeng up. But because you are aware of what he is up to, you can go thru' this like a pro. MB, these eggheads who comply to his evil whims are going to get the message. Just play along the game. This may sound crazy to you but when I had to succumb to similar web of crap from my boss; every bulleying tactics maneuvered by him from different directions, I mean from others in the place where I work even the ones outside of my department,will drive you crazy. I had days that I could not get myself to get up and get ready for work. I started having anxiety attacks. He had co-workers literally paged me and do other duties outside of my job descriptions and set me up to fail or appear as if I am not a team player. He called me once and chewed my ass infront of someone who use to be my co-dept. head who is just like him a bulley and an a BI***. He used this woman to make my life miserable for awhile. Well, he FAILED!!!! THEY BOTH FAILED.
    Play along with his game, then slap him with a letter notifying him that these are not things that will not go un-noticed, and that it will be reported to EEOC as blatant retaliation tactics coming from him that YOU are well aware of.
    The co-workers, well they will also get the message by your treating them just as nice as you have been. If they know they are being used by your boss to intimidate you, unless they have something against you.....it will eventually stop. Then you can build rapport with them and let them know bits and pieces of what your evil boss is up to. You might just find someone who despise him also. I did it!...not one but several:):):):):)on my side now. And the bulley co-workers that he used----- had stopped completely.

    Posted 7 hours ago #
  29. littlelulu

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    And you are documenting all this, right?? I have a feeling that HE has told your co-workers that YOU are doing unethical things that could get THEM fired so they have turned on you. Either that, or he HAS directed them to treat you this way or be fired. Whichever the case may be, he IS retaliating against you for filing the EEOC complaint which is SO TOTALLY ILLEGAL.

    Posted 6 hours ago #

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